water leak from front of diesel engine in rcz

[danieldavid]

Hi, in case anyone has any ideas on how to proceed, ive removed undertray, noticed the sump had surface rust from water dripping down front of engine, so wire brushed and hamerired it. So its leaking coolant from the front of the engine above the level of the rim of the top of the sump somewhere. Ive attached 2 pics, its coming through the bolt position in the middle of the pic under the car, and theres a wet area above the sump ring on the pic of the top of the engine in the centre. The oil is black and free of water, the coolant is free of oil, thankfully!. Any advice on how to proceed on deducing what needs changed from anyones experience and knowledge would be appreciated. Should i just buy seals for the egr and oil cooer and do both as theres so much to be stripped? or do you see an easy way to determine which. Should i buy one of those probe cameras to try to work out exactly where its coming from from front. As far as i can see the two water pipes coming out above the join between engine and gearbox where the bleed screw is for coolant, seem fine. Im guessing its unlikely a hole in the block releasing water or a water only head gasket leak. Im guessing it might be the oil cooler, im guessing it might be the egr housing, both are strapped onto the front of the diesel engine. When the engine starts running without even having the coolant expansion cap on without pressure, starts the drip around every second almost instantaneously.

Im ready to change belts and waterpump and oil, but want to try to sort the water leak first to only use one set of fluids... Could it be seaping from some other component, ive got the drivers side jacked up more than passengers so guessing water is moving towards middle of car more than normal when it fibally drips from low point, but pretty sure its not coming from rear of engine, cross over or thermostrat housing. Hope its not head gasket one way water leak, or pin hole in block, ive only seen the later once in searches over past few days, thanks..

many thanks for any advice its a 2.0 diesel rcz

 

[EddieJ]

Hi, I stay away from diesel cars, sorry just a personal thing…dirty oul things, but where you leak is possibly coming from I think I would have a thermostat housing, oil filter housing gaskets (full set, not just block) as well as the egr. I would also be prepared for a bit of time cleaning off carbon build up. Hopefully that way when you tear into it and do all those you not only fix the leak, but also hit the common ones before they do. Also have a really good look around the turbo pipes.

 

[rczpali]

Would suggest trying a pressure test kit... if the leak isnt obvious... very easy to attach to the expansion tank, apply pressure and the leak would hopefully reveal itself. Just traced leak on my 1.6 petrol and also made sure there were no other leaks using one of these kits. They are around £50 on amazon. Hope you get it sorted soon. Good Luck

 

[rczpali]

This is the kit I purchased BOOMSTART 28Pcs Universal Radiator Pressure Tester and Car Vacuum Cooling System Tester Tool Kit Applicable for Audi for VW for BMW : Amazon.co.uk: Automotive

 

[danieldavid]

Thanks kindly for responses, ive thought about getting the pressure kit, but thankfully it drips even when not running and not under presaure, i almost bought a snake camera, but got my top of one of my mobile phones in under the front components and the damp patch is around the oil cooler as far as i can see. It looks like one of the bolts might be missing on this, i think there are meant to be 4, unless its recessed, thats a tight place to work in, ive ordered a gasket set, will try to strip it down soon. Thankfully when i did timing belt yeterday, the coolant that poored out was free of oil so pretty convinved no mixing, even the oil is black, im guessing a failure in just the part of the gasket against the block that carries coolant only. Apparently the new mini is even more tight a place to work in. thanks again. I noticed there are no videos on youtube or threads on this site on doing diesel cambelt, i might put a thread on my approach to it, that was a fidly job to do, due to complexities, many thanks again, thankfully ive ruled out the items to the rear of the block like the crossover pipe and thermostat housing as the leak is from the fron on the hdi.

 

[danieldavid]

Just to show further findings on this, i ordered the following item from ebay, has 4 gaskets for resealing the join from oil cooler to engine block, and i think the o ring as well for the coolant pipe, with the coolant pipe also. Ive looked at the oil coolere design and compared to othes and as far as i can see the oil is only going theough the circular area that meets the block, with a quarter and three quarters split by direction i think, and the two metal pipes coming off the housing must be for coolant, this seems more simple than the other peugeot oil cooler thats on many vehicles which has 6 not 4 openings. So given ive got a coolant leak behind the oil cooler, i can only think it has to be the little 4 inch long rubber pipe or o ring than the actual gasket, as its coolant not oil. Ive tried to work out how to get into it, and as far as i can see there are 3 nuts to be removed, possibly 8mm or a bit more, they are tight to access due to pipes everywhere. I think im going to have to undo those 3 nuts to take the oil cooler out in order to get to the pipe behind, i cant even get my mobile with video running to determine if theres any leak from it, its so tight a space with the oil cooler in place. I thought removing the oil filter cover and filter would help but it still doesnt reveal the bottom majority of the rubber coolant pipe. The kit has the replacement pipe in so will probably replace this and o ring and the gasket on the back of the oil cooler, once ive disturnbed the oil oil gasket. I dont see any issues with the connection between the little rectangular radiator and the rest of the oil cooler so i never ordered those gaskets. Getting the oil filter out is tricky, i ended up using a large adjustable spanner, and turning about 1/16 of a turn at a time, but got the oil filter out eventually. Ive not seen such a difficult to access oil filter on a car. In the pic, the pipe is the one coming out the engine in the middle, black plastic right angle joint with a metal clip holding to the hose, there must be a clip further down at other end, im guessing that might be where leak is on mine.

the item on ebay is under

OIL COOLER GASKET SEAL SET FOR FORD FOCUS III GALAXY IIGRAND C-MAX I 1103.L4 item 256571289934

i paid about £7 from MYS AUTO, it arrived quite quickly

I'll let you all know if this resolves but i cant think anywhere else the coolant leak could be coming from, in case anyone has similar issue, its a common issue it seems

 

[danieldavid]

hi, spent hours today removing the bolts and nuts that hold the oil cooler in place on the diesel, its a really fiddly job, the 3 main nuts that hold the on are out of sight but 2 can be accessed from above and one from below, I wasnt able to get the oil cooler out as the little radiator had to be removed as it doesnt clear the air conditioning pump, i think thats what it is, so the 4 tiny bolts can be removed using an allen key torx or rachet with torx fitting. I was able to do this without dismantling anything, just the undertrays disconnected. The problem now is i cant get the oil cooler out as it seems to be hindered by one or possibly two things, one is the pipe at the back that connects the oil cooler to the engione block for coolant, and the other is the oil pipe that connects thye engine block to the sump with a T join that connects to the oil filler tube/cap. Ive attached a couple of pics, but if anyoine knows, welcome to let me know

1 - in the pic with the oil cooler below and in the middle of the pic the small pipe that connects to the block with a right angle, there are older style, not jubilee, clips, any ideas how you discoinnect these, this is holdong the pipe in place between the oil cooler and the block behind. Should i just cut the old pipe as kit has new one?

3 - in the pic of the oil pipe with T junction, where the small pipe goes to the block, not the big pipe with the metal connection, any ideas how you disconnect those types of plastic connections, as this pipe is adjacent to the rigid dipstick tube, and could be hindering the unit coming out? i tried seperating it but couldnt manage to

ive nearly got the oil cooler out, it sits ion 3 studs into the block, and they are mayve 3cm long, i reckion it clears 2cm, but the last 1cm to clear to get it off, thanks

this is the last thiong i know of to do to the car, im pretty sure the pipe behind the oil cooler must be source of leaking as wet behind, i dont think its the egr housing.

 

[danieldavid]

the rcz is so rare, but this is someone taking out the egr housing on a 508 2.0 hdi, and theres a coolant hose to the drivers side aboe where ive had a leak, so not impossible its this rather than the cooler, though i assume its the water pipe behind the oil cooler. 8 mins in

 

[danieldavid]

Also, i dont know if this is related, its winter now, but i havent noticed the fan coming on, if i wanted to check fan or sensors that trigger it, what are the most obvious things to check on a 2.0 hdi circa 2009 to 2015, thanks again for any advice

 

[danieldavid]

one other thought on this, before i start dismantling more things, but after i did the watrer pump replacement as part of the timing belt replacement, its not dripped from the front as it usually did before. Sometimes it didnt drip and sometimes id did when cold and unpressured, but does anyone know if the weephole outlet from the waterpump on 2.0hdi engines would result in water behind the oil cooler or above it at front of engine, i was guesssing not as the pump is on the side, thanks

 

[danieldavid]

this is starting to make me think i might not have a leak, as some weep holes push the coolant to front block.....

 

[danieldavid]

in case anyone else has similar problems and is looking to try to understand causes, so after i changed belts and water pump the level seemed to not drop. but after i removed and put back the oil cooler (ill mention later how i think this can be done if anyone needs to in future), when i topped up ythe header expansion tank, it was dripping about 2 or 3 drips per second or a litre per 30 mins, cold without even the cap on . I thought i would try a sachet of K seal as i couldnt work out if the leak was oil cooler, or egr, or something else. I bought the K seal wednesday morning,, bled air out, heated up the engine expecting water to drip out and leave room for the K seal, but it didnt. I had to drive it 15 miles before there was space for the K seal, I drove another 30 miles after pouring in, i noticed that evening there was three quarters of a litre missing, this may have been lost in the first 15 miles before pouring in or before it started to work. I topped up with antifreeze friday morning and drove 40 miles and the level never dropped, so it looks like there was a tiny release somewhere for a bit of fluid to escape but for K seal to seal it, within a milimeter. This is what its designed to do i think. I drove 70 miles today including some idling in traffic and again it hasnt lost fluid, but one thing i notice is that the fan never seems to come on. Should the fan come on when stationary even at low speed fan setting, i think ill now try testing the f21 engine compartment fuse for the fan, as the fan never seems to come on, its winter in scotland 6 degrees and my fans set at 27 degrees in the cabin, but does anyone know if the fan should still go on slow?

That was only 12.99 for the k seal, its supposed to be a permanent fix and creates a seal in harline cracks in components and some say even up against rubber & plastic

 

[danieldavid]

ps, the oil cooler is held on by 3 nuts, i used a half length extension bar, 2 from above, 1 from underneath, its really fiddly, you cant see one of the nuts. then the 4 tiny bolts have to be removed to remove the mini radiator to alow the oil cooler to pull past the structure below as the 3 studs are 3cm long, this is even more fiddly, i used an allen key torx and a tiny torx bit to undo these, and put back. 2 from below, 2 from above, you can just see all 4 of these, but its time consuming, i had to remove gloves for some, one of them you can only get a small part turn at a time. I noticed the oil cooler was resisting coming off by the final 1cm over the studs, i think it can be taken off by removing the first 2 of 3 components in the 508 video in this thread, up to before the egr is removed, i think this allows access to remove the small metal plate and bolt holding the plastic pipe and o ring into the block, i think this would need to be removed to get the oil cooler out. The oil pipe from sump to block is also wedged againsat the dipstick that also resists less so the removal of the oil cooler, i think the dipstick is loosened as part of the set of procedures in the 508 video, so i think should allow oil cooler to come out if needed, theres a tight pipe that runs across the front of the coolant pipe from oil cooler to the block,but i think disconnecting the coolant pipe from block to oil cooler would allow the oil coler to become free. On mine the original pipe clips are older clips the crimping type tool is needed for, not newer jubilee clips. Im going to stasrt investigating the fan mechanism to see if thats not working, just in case, but coolant seems sealed in now.

 

[danieldavid]

i checked f21 and its got continuity on a meter, so i might look at the fan motor and the relay unit at front of car. In my case it never overheats on the guage, never seems to go above 90 but strangely i never hear a fan, even at low speed working.