Camshaft Position - slow response

[jpdaly1979]

Hey all,

Just bought an rcz and I absolute love it. But after driving my rcz for about 10 mins I always get the following error camshaft position slow response.

I just keep clearing the error but it keeps coming back - is this an expensive fix?

it was seriously overheating, I had the thermostat housing replaced, now it’s still overheating and I have a coolant leak (yes I took it to a garage). - I will make another post about this. But maybe this is something todo with it.

Any help would be appreciated

 

[EddieJ]

Petrol? 156/200/270 Bhp? Mileage? On original timing chain?

Based on a 156 petrol;
can also be a fault with the vanos not pulling forward correctly, vanos gear faulty or vanos solenoid faulty and can be a result of poor servicing regime and these fouled with mucky oil sludge. Flushing can help, but replacing may be required.

However can also relate to worn chain (often referred to as stretched). If the chain has been done recently, it’s in need of timing position checking.
Following the ‘book’ exactly in reference to the pre tensioning to 6Nm prior to tightening the cam bolts is just wrong. The actual tensioner should be used and fully secured, then cams tightened to torque value. Engine rotated fully twice, cam locking kit refitted and gap checked. Then angle torqued to final tension.

Timing chain out of position is evident in the first pic, the square section of the cam can be seen as not in position by the flag (screwdriver) not being perpendicular, ie at =90deg second pic shows with the timing hold tooling in position and there is an excessive gap, ie cam out of position. Third pic shows timing kit in position and should be able to be located down flat with no forcing. Permissible gap tolerance is less than 1mm (I’ll check exact later).

Timing out can also create an overheating issue, but air locking happening from the leak can. With the overheating, coolant loss there are a few areas for quick check, expansion bottle, thermostat housing (which you’ve done) and thermostat cross pipe, sometimes not done with thermo housing but inevitably gets disturbed and starts leaking, and water pump. A leak may have caused an air lock and with the leak tracked down and resolved, engine bled etc you might be fine. Depending on how long it has been run too hot the head gasket may have failed. Might be worthwhile doing a head gasket test using the fluid test kits available at most autofactors to ass if exhaust gases are evident in the coolant. The colour of the coolant can also be a giveaway, black scum on top and discoloured though with thermo housing just done this may now be clean looking.
Have a pressure test carried out on the coolant circuit, will quickly lead to the point of the leak.

 

[lfe]

Is there foam under the oil filler cap? do you see black sludge?

Maybe the oil is contaminated with coolant and the VANOS fails because of the dirty oil.

If it has had several overheatings, the cylinder head gasket must be suspected.

 

[jpdaly1979]

Petrol? 156/200/270 Bhp? Mileage? On original timing chain?

Based on a 156 petrol;
can also be a fault with the vanos not pulling forward correctly, vanos gear faulty or vanos solenoid faulty and can be a result of poor servicing regime and these fouled with mucky oil sludge. Flushing can help, but replacing may be required.

However can also relate to worn chain (often referred to as stretched). If the chain has been done recently, it’s in need of timing position checking.
Following the ‘book’ exactly in reference to the pre tensioning to 6Nm prior to tightening the cam bolts is just wrong. The actual tensioner should be used and fully secured, then cams tightened to torque value. Engine rotated fully twice, cam locking kit refitted and gap checked. Then angle torqued to final tension.

Timing chain out of position is evident in the first pic, the square section of the cam can be seen as not in position by the flag (screwdriver) not being perpendicular, ie at =90deg second pic shows with the timing hold tooling in position and there is an excessive gap, ie cam out of position. Third pic shows timing kit in position and should be able to be located down flat with no forcing. Permissible gap tolerance is less than 1mm (I’ll check exact later).

Timing out can also create an overheating issue, but air locking happening from the leak can. With the overheating, coolant loss there are a few areas for quick check, expansion bottle, thermostat housing (which you’ve done) and thermostat cross pipe, sometimes not done with thermo housing but inevitably gets disturbed and starts leaking, and water pump. A leak may have caused an air lock and with the leak tracked down and resolved, engine bled etc you might be fine. Depending on how long it has been run too hot the head gasket may have failed. Might be worthwhile doing a head gasket test using the fluid test kits available at most autofactors to ass if exhaust gases are evident in the coolant. The colour of the coolant can also be a giveaway, black scum on top and discoloured though with thermo housing just done this may now be clean looking.
Have a pressure test carried out on the coolant circuit, will quickly lead to the point of the leak.

Thank you for the amazing reply. I have the petrol 200bhp. 2011. Mileage is 86k.

The engine temp gauge never goes above the indication in the picture. When I blow my fans on anything over 3 it blows luke warm air and then the temp gauge on the dash seems to go down (this could be a factor of my imagination, but I’m sure this is true. I’ve seen it happen a few times). I’ve bought a new thermostat housing, sensor, all wires etc and it’s being fitted this coming Wednesday - I didn’t trust the previous mechanic as they had my car 4 months (I told them to fix the overheating and oil leak) they said it needed a new thermostat housing, anyway 4 months later they told me it was done, I took it straight to MOT station and one of the advisories coolant leak at the thermostat housing and oil leak. The car overheated driving to the test station. It failed on needing new cv joint (now done) and a few bulbs replacing.
I’ve checked the oil dipstick and filler cap and I can’t see any milky residue (I’ve had an MG TF160 with head gasket issue).

while the new mechanic is replacing thermostat housing - should I also get him to do the timing chain, if yes, could I be cheeky and ask you to link me to the parts required on AUTODOC - my reg is WP11DMF. I would rate my mechanical ability as 0/10 so I have little to no idea on understanding the pictures you uploaded, but I will be sure to show the new mechanic this post thread

thanks again!

 

[jpdaly1979]

Is there foam under the oil filler cap? do you see black sludge?

Maybe the oil is contaminated with coolant and the VANOS fails because of the dirty oil.

If it has had several overheatings, the cylinder head gasket must be suspected.

No foam or sludge, I’ve checked filler cap and dipstick. I will ask the mechanic todo a head gasket check. Thanks for your help

 

[EddieJ]

I’ll try and write up a bit when I get into work this evening.
But for info, the happy RCZ temp is 90 static, not above or below, so something amiss.

 

[jpdaly1979]

I’ll try and write up a bit when I get into work this evening.
But for info, the happy RCZ temp is 90 static, not above or below, so something amiss.

Im hoping the new sensor and wires will show the correct engine temp. It was shooting steam out of the coolant reservoir (won’t let me upload video, but you can imagine). I read up about the engine needing burping, so I did that and I no longer get any steam out the reservoir. I just drove 25 miles on the motorway @ 60mph - I got the same camshaft error as above again.

it also seems I’m missing a part here - see attachment. No idea what it’s called, otherwise I would just order one. I know something was there before I took it to the mechanic who replaced the thermostat housing.

Arrrrggghhh I just wanna go drive my rcz like it’s meant to be driven. It’s killing me lol

 

[EddieJ]

Sound box cover, not essential but finishes things off. Just like the engine undertrays some mechs don’t like and leave off.

 

[EddieJ]

Have you stopped overheating?